Axial 28 RR update!

[moose2851]

OK so some of you have read my other threads on RB's and my humming hawing over whether to take the Axial out of the box or not. Well I did and am I glad that I did I can see why people hate them and don't get past 5 or 6 tanks.

Tanks 1-2 break in everything normal easy to start
Tank 3 circles harder to start little tougher to keep running leaned out a little
Tank 4 more circles very hard to get started and loading up a lot stalled out at least 15 to 20 times
tank 5 tuning time- can't get it started broke the pull cord can't keep it running farting and popping all over the place (not me the truck)
-changed air cleaner from genaric piece to stock HPI and richen it like crazy and changed the glow plug
Tank 6 tuning Got it started ran till it almost quit 1/8 turn in did this until it would change to second then LSN 1?8 at a time ran better and better tweaked the HSN started changing to third
Tank 7-8 Continue tuning and playing to get it just right notice each half a tank it has been getting faster off the line and better top end
Tank 9-11 Took it to the gravel pit beat the heck out of it wheelies every where huge air terrific acelleration amazing top end sounded funny at first getting better and better staying at like 270f my HPI 4.6 didn'y run good until is was like 320F starts like a dream.

I must say I wanted to give up and call Axial and LHS and tare them a new one but I stuck it out and with some help from some off you on here I persavered through the pain in the *** stuff and now have a mean green machine pushing my savy up 300 feet of sand and gravel piles. Does a mean back flip too! Thanks again for being there again fellow members:jamout:

 

[backwoodboys11]

moose I'm glad you got it going.hate to hear you had such a rough time though,but it sounds like it was worth it.
mine runs sweet around 265 to 280.

 

[Larsenracing]

Awsome bud, I'm glad you got threw the pain and have suscedded with a sucessfull motor. Keep up intune with how it goes.

 

[X]

I'm glad you got it going, but not surprised with the issues you've had. I'm curious though about you running 320 degrees on a K4.6. This is about a hundred degrees over what the engine averagely runs at, my engine included.

 

[joeyd01]

300 degrees you are Tempering Steel. It will become very brittle and pretty much be ruined.

 

[k0m0d067]

300 degrees you are Tempering Steel. It will become very brittle and pretty much be ruined.

good thing it's not made of steel huh? :duh: ABC construction (used in pretty much every nitro motor out there) consists of Aluminum, Brass, and Chrome...

 

[joeyd01]

You can temper aluminum as well as many metals. I just used steel as an example.(A bad example I guess, I was just thinking of those guys heating up steel and dipping in oil) If the metal gets to hot bad things will happen just the same, regardless of ABC construction. That is why they sell thermometers and everyone that I have spoken with says you don't want to hit or go over 300. I am a newb and don't know the ABC construction. But I do know to hot is Bad. Just trying to save the guy some cash.

 

[MotoPsycho]

Every engine is a little different on what it likes. Granted, higher temps are harder on stuff, but if your engine runs the best hot... run it!

It won't last as long, but they don't last long anyway - Run it like you stole it!

 

[k0m0d067]

yes, I agree, and high heat IS always a bad thing...but "tempering" aluminum...more commonly known as Solution Heat Treating requires MUCH higher temperatures than you would ever see in an RC car (the non-metallic bits would begin to melt)

Solution Heat Treating - Cast, extruded, or forged pieces are heated to 850°F to 1050°F so that soluble alloying elements can diffuse evenly throughout the metal in solid solution. Precise temperature control and timing are important. Larger castings may require up to twenty hours of soaking while thin sheet may require only a minute.

the temeratures reaslistically reached in a Nitro motor would fall more likely into either Precipitation Heat treating...

Precipitation Heat Treatment - Also called artificial aging, this treatment promotes the precipitation of solute atoms of alloying elements for enhanced strength characteristics. Aging ovens operate in the range of 250° to 350°F. While the process is often integrated with solution heat treatment, a separate furnace is typically used because the heating temperatures and capacity required are much lower.

or Annealing...

Annealing - Large work-pieces and those that have been subjected to cold working operations may require annealing, or stress relieving, to soften the metal and relieve the stresses of working. Annealing temperatures range between 300° and 600° with soak times of up to five hours


it's actually the "dipping in oil" part that you reffered to that causes the biggest concerns, as the rapid cooling is what causes the "tempering" of the steel...it's also called "Quenching"...

Quenching - After solution treatment, it is important to cool the work-piece quickly to preserve the proper crystalline microstructure. This cooling is usually achieved by water immersion or water sprays. Quenching operations must be carefully integrated with heat treatment furnaces to avoid uncontrolled slow cooling.


So, reaching temps of 300 would all into the category of Precipitation Heat Treating, which, as stated, actually promotes "enhanced strength characteristics"...

the parts that suffer most when the higher temps are reached are the bearings...

 

[moose2851]

Wow that's some great discussion guys thanks I don't know what it is with my HPI engine 300 to 320 runs amaxing I have 6 gals through it I run 33% nitro with 12% oil mix. Never had a problem when you look inside the head light very light brown tarnish mostly looks like it just came out of the box and will pull the tires off the ground in second gear. My Axial 28 RR that I have 15 tanks through now runs 250-270 and that seems to be the ideal range for this motor. The guys in my RC club run there motors at 350-380 and many of them run way past 13-15gals through their motors but they are serious hillclimbers and the motors are really pulling under a huge load. You guys all rock thanks for this discussion

 

[k0m0d067]

yeah...sorry to get your thread off track...glad you're having fun with your Axial

 

[joeyd01]

Holy crap dude, this was never supposed to be a "sword fight" to use a "G" rated analogy. It was all written with good intentions. Also Nothing I wrote was even confrontational. I said that guy and the oil thing is what I was picturing NOT FACT. I think my quote was "Bad example I guess" I was not trying to be that know it all we all love so much, Look at how times I've actually posted. You really need to put it away safe behind your zipper.
I've heard don't go over 300 at hobby shops all over my state (I travel for work and get bored), at the track, and so on. 5 min from my house is a track they do some of the testing for RC driver and Rc car action. Seeming I am a newb I ask alot of questions cause I don't want to screw up an engine. So whatever works for you go for it, personally I was just going by what everyone else told me. So instead of getting engineers involved and poking our eyes out, I will stay under 300 you can play on your computer research things to death just because......I need not say more.

moose2851 - I apologise for anything coming off wrong.

k0m0d067 - compensate - com·pen·sate make up for shortcomings or a feeling of inferiority by exaggerating good qualities

 

[THE JUDGE]

Very interesting info there K0m0d0...it actually is nice to know what happens at what temp to our motors...Thanks for sharing that!

Also, I really don't think anyone at all has attacked you Joey...in fact I see quite the opposite happening here. If you really want to learn anything, I suggest you keep yourself open to FACTS. If it wasn't for engineers you wouldn't even have a motor, or a truck for that matter...I don't know if K0m0d0's an engineer to begin with, but I for one appreciate when someone provides factual info, especially when it's pertinent to the contents of a thread.

:beer:

 

[AllanQ]

Glad to hear you got your motor broken in. Break in can be a pain in the butt, but you will be better off in the long run. The getting faster off the line and more top end speed at half of a tank of fuel you noticed during tanks 7-8 sound like the half tank lean most of us experience. Nothing to worry about, sounds like you got it tuned it and ready to rip. Have fun!

 

[joeyd01]

Honestly foget it.
I was not Knocking engineers, Please re-read. I admittingly used a bad example. I just was trying to help. @#$% me for trying. Run them all at 300 plus. Again I am a NEWB as stated 3 times. My mind is open, The actual method of tempering does not pertain to this thread or do I care. I wrongfully tried making a point. I think that was said already.
This all is about picking at something minor, the point was lost, and it's really a shame and it's silly.